The Internet WE Want: Perspectives from the Amazonian Region | IGF 2023 Day 0 Event #185

Paloma Lara Castro

The comprehensive analysis underscores a pressing issue affecting indigenous communities – significant digital inequality. This inequality manifests profoundly in the scarce accessibility to the internet, which, when available, is often restricted, prohibitively expensive, and of sub-standard quality. Additionally, these communities encounter further challenges due to a profound lack of digital literacy.

A paramount argument presented stresses the need for more expansive, higher quality, and affordable internet access for these indigenous communities. Enhancing internet accessibility can serve as an integral step towards mitigating societal inequality experienced in these regions, thus contributing towards the actualisation of Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs) 9 and 10, focusing on Industry, Innovation, Infrastructure, and Reduced Inequality.

Further, the analysis suggests that public policies can play a pivotal role in tackling this pressing issue. Policies promoting an intercultural perspective and fostering technological autonomy within these communities are viewed as highly beneficial. Such strategies not only align with SDGs 16 and 17, endorsing Peace, Justice, Strong Institutions, and Partnerships for the Goals, but also empower these communities to harness ICTs fully.

A noteworthy proposition put forth involves the exploration of alternative models of internet access, with specific emphasis on community networks. The significance of a holistic perspective when formulating connectivity policies is emphasised, aligned with the objectives of SDG 9.

The review also brings to light the crucial role of internet access as a means to basic human rights and community development. This perspective underscores the importance of digital connectivity in enabling local populations to avail of health services, education, public services, and exercise freedom of expression. This assertion aligns with SDGs 4, 3, and 8, promoting Quality Education, Good Health, Well-being, and Decent Work and Economic Growth, reinforcing the argument that effective internet access indeed serves as a pathway to actualising and enhancing human rights and community development.

In conclusion, augmenting the levels of digital connectivity and literacy, encouraging public policies inducing technological autonomy, exploring new models of internet access, and acknowledging the importance of the internet as a route to human rights and community growth collectively underscore the potential means to meeting the needs and accelerating the development of indigenous communities.

Dagmar Tilguth Fundamedios

The current state of internet accessibility in the Amazon is perceived negatively due to its impact on educational disparity and cultural shifts, with high costs and infrastructure shortages being significant obstacles. Currently, internet services are exorbitantly priced, consuming as much as 17% of the national base salary, thereby being out of reach for many citizens. Specifically, in the province of Pastaza, these issues are quite prevalent, with only 41% having access to satellite internet due to the lack of stable electricity sources.

The digital divide’s socio-cultural effects in the region are profound, marked by a noticeable loss of identity among young indigenous people. This is mainly attributed to the sway of social media, which somewhat paradoxically widens the cultural gap whilst enhancing connectivity.

Considering these compounding factors, there is a growing call for state intervention to boost internet access in the Amazon, with the view that it’s a pivotal human right and could catalyse community development. It’s strongly advocated that government policies should aim to bridge the prevailing digital divide by spearheading necessary infrastructure improvements.

There’s a shared sentiment among local residents about the vast benefits of amplified online connectivity. Not only could it bolster local businesses, it is also seen as a crucial tool for familial bonds and community connections. Internet connectivity would also provide a means for organising indigenous leaders, potentially aiding in preserving their identity whilst integrating with the broader society. This call for improvements is underscored by the adults consulted, illustrating a community-wide consensus towards Amazon region’s progress.

In conclusion, a combination of state intervention and infrastructure development could dramatically alter the situation by ensuring universal internet access in the Amazon. Resultingly, this could ease the education disparity, reduce negative cultural shifts and ultimately lead to a more interconnected and empowered Amazonian community.

Ms Paredes

The inadequate internet access in Bolivian Amazon communities significantly hinders the delivery of virtual education. This issue is exacerbated by insufficient equipment, obstructing the successful launch of a virtual education policy. This unfortunate situation negatively impacts the quality of education, hindering the broader pursuit of Sustainable Development Goal (SDG) 4: Quality Education, and SDG 9: Industry, Innovation and Infrastructure.

In contrast, Amazon social organisations are taking proactive measures to address this deficiency by engaging assertively with the state. These groups have even shouldered expenses for community members to travel to government offices to voice their concerns. This illustrates a broader societal commitment to SDG 16: Peace, Justice, and Strong Institutions.

Significantly, the communities themselves recognise internet access as a vital instrument to safeguard their rights and shape their identities. For some indigenous communities, the internet has emerged as a powerful platform to develop economic relationships, facilitate self-expression, and construct identities. There have been laudable initiatives such as diffusion of native languages and establishment of organisational groups that defend the communities against threats.

However, the inadequate access to the internet underscores further inequalities, posing a considerable obstacle in achieving the aforementioned SDGs. This starkly highlights the need for significant improvements in internet access in the Bolivian Amazon communities.

In conclusion, an urgent action plan is required to enhance internet access in these communities. Such an initiative would markedly contribute to their development, aligning them closer to the accomplishment of the related Sustainable Development Goals. Moreover, the internet provides a critical platform for self-expression, identity building and economic growth, alongside improved educational tools and infrastructure.

Carlos Baca

The review underscores the pivotal role of community networks and local solutions in engendering sustainability and stimulating innovation. It brings attention to significant projects such as Hermes and the National School of Community Networks in Brazil, presenting concrete examples of how localised solutions prove more sustainable due to their direct link with the community’s lifestyle. These solutions, designed to meet the unique requirements of each community, further engender positive sentiment within these areas.

Additionally, the review suggests that synergistic collaborations between various key stakeholders, including the governmental sector and assorted organisations, are pivotal to the process. Technology selection demands comprehensive consideration and strategic partnerships, with the chosen technology needing to directly respond to the distinctive needs and challenges of each territory.

The review also emphasises the significance of capacity building and digital literacy. The argument extends beyond the usage of the internet, venturing into the critical examination of technologies and how they can be utilised to cater to the specific needs of communities.

Moreover, the review delves into the varied interpretation of internet connectivity. Internet access is characterised as a diverse network facilitating myriad connections, rather than a monolithic, universal entity. The right to disconnect is posed as a counterpart to the right to connect, showcasing recognition of digital rights and controlled internet use.

The autonomy of internet connectivity is presented as crucial, particularly in the context of indigenous communities. Noted as varying in internet use, these communities are empowered through autonomy to commandeer their own mode of access and usage.

Further, the important potential technology harbours to maintain and reshape identities within communities is recognised. Engaging conversations transpiring across generations within these communities aim to discover optimal ways to incorporate technology into their lives, consequently preserving their unique identities.

Finally, the review delves into the fascinating aspect of controlling the risks associated with internet connection, referencing community networks. It further highlights how community networks understand that internet connectivity has constraints. Thus acknowledging a balanced approach towards digital rights and responsibilities, including the power to regulate specific network operations, becomes indispensable. The review contends that solutions to the risks associated with internet connectivity aren’t one-size-fits-all, and should instead adapt to the distinct demands of each community.

Camila Leide

The analysis underscores the multifaceted challenges Brazil grapples with concerning internet connectivity. These hurdles are starkly shaped by socio-economic disparities and infrastructural hindrances. Economically deprived and geographically isolated areas, particularly in the northern regions, confront these issues intensely. Internet access here is not only limited but also pricey, exacerbating the inequality. Additionally, the inferior quality of service and reliance on mobile internet spotlight this burgeoning digital divide.

Data caps imposed on mobile internet frequently result in inadequate internet availability for users throughout the month, cultivating heavy dependence on big tech platforms. This reliance raises significant concerns, intensifying economic inequalities through further consolidation of power in the hands of these large corporations.

However, the analysis suggests potential alternatives. Community networks are proposed as a counterweight to the over-reliance on hefty telecom companies. These serve as locally sourced solutions that could address the connectivity needs of underserved communities, signifying a positive stride in the right direction.

Notably, the escalating dependence on connectivity solutions offered by corporations such as Elon Musk’s Starlink has evoked apprehensions. There is disquiet surrounding potential monopolisation by Starlink and issues related to digital sovereignty, primarily owing to vague details about the Brazilian government’s partnership with the company. The environmental impact of satellites further fuels these apprehensions.

Emanating from the community, there is a clearly articulated need for enhanced connectivity and a yearning for a deeper understanding of internet usage. Despite progresses in connectivity, preserving their culture in the digital age, especially with surrounding ‘big centres’, fuels anxiety.

Another potent insight revealed in the analysis is the critique of public consultations by the telecommunications authority. They are perceived as infrequent and biased towards the private sector, advocating for a broader civil society participation. Robust involvement from organisations such as EDEC is emphasised as vital to bringing a much-needed perspective and assuring inclusive decision-making.

The intricacy of delivering optimum internet access is acknowledged as having no “one size fits all” solution. Hence, it is paramount to continue dialogues and conversations on these topics, which will allow for the consideration of the specificities and unique needs of different communities. Such an approach paves the way for advancements in a more tailored and effective manner. This point resonates as a constructive conclusion from the analysis, demonstrating the crucial need for consistent, meaningful engagement on the challenges and potential solutions relevant to internet connectivity in Brazil.

Publika

The discourse is an exploration of the potential establishment of internet connectivity in the Amazon region. Specifically, it delves into the possibility of influential U.S. corporates such as Elon Musk exerting substantial influence over this untouched territory. The argument at the heart of the debate advocates for an alliance at SILAC to serve as a strategic bulwark to prevent this territory’s exploitation by U.S. imperialistic endeavours. The perspective forwarded carries a negative sentiment, rooted in concerns of external entities infringing on the region’s sovereignty.

Concurrently, the discourse underscores the value of considering not merely the aspect of internet connectivity but broadening the sphere of focus to comprise digital technology and community networks. These tools are perceived as crucial catalysts for material and cultural production within communities. Interestingly, the discussion points out that an internet connection is not always required for access to digital culture. This viewpoint carries a positive sentiment, indicating a more contextualised and nuanced comprehension of technological innovation and accessibility, reflecting Sustainable Development Goal (SDG) 9: Industry, Innovation and Infrastructure, as well as SDG 11: Sustainable Cities and Communities.

To provide a more holistic analysis of the communities’ digital needs, the discourse encourages exploring outside the confines of conventional social media alternatives. This approach aims to better grasp the communities’ aspirations and requirements regarding the use of the internet within their own territory. The sentiment here is neutral, yet it is vital in developing a well-rounded strategy that addresses local necessities and respects unique contexts.

A key component of the dialogue is the challenge facing indigenous communities; namely, how to maintain their distinctive cultural identity amidst the proliferation of digital technologies. Their goal is to navigate this multifaceted landscape without conceding the essence of their heritage and customs. This perspective has a positive sentiment, broadening the dialogue to include SDG 10: Reduced Inequalities, and recognising these communities’ right to digital access without sacrificing their cultural distinctiveness.

To conclude, this discourse efficiently interweaves different SDGs, encapsulating industry and innovation, sustainable cities, reduced inequalities, and partnerships for goals. It presents a multifaceted analysis, acknowledging both the complexities of integrating digital technologies into underserved areas and the importance of preserving cultural identities while resisting unwarranted external influences.

Michael Souza

The assembly began with convenors voicing gratitude to participants for attending despite early scheduling and a somewhat challenging registration process. This interactive dialogue aimed to spotlight critical aspects of the project, “Latin America in a Glimpse of Amazonia.”

The speaker panel included Camila Leide, a recognised expert in digital rights from the Brazilian Institute of Consumer Protection (IVEC). A distinguished lawyer and educator, Camila disseminates her understanding of digital rights and consumer law at IDP. Notably, she is also pursuing her Doctorate in competition law at the esteemed University of Sao Paulo.

Equally prominent was Carlos Baca, who brought his expertise in ICT network management to the discussions. A PhD holder from the Autonomous University of Puebla, Carlos has led training programmes on ICT network management in indigenous and rural Latin American communities since 2019. His ventures include a pivotal role in the LockNet initiative by Rizomatica and APC, where he oversees their capacity building area.

The crux of the conversation highlighted the importance of autonomy for indigenous communities, particularly with regard to achieving accurate and independent internet connectivity. This concept encapsulated the sovereign rights of indigenous communities to govern their internet connectivity needs, free of exterior influences.

The dialogue encouraged a vibrant exchange with the audience members, inviting their astute queries and constructive commentary. It offered a range of stimulating responses about the requisites for internet connectivity and the drivers behind it. These responses were diverse, reflecting a variety of perspectives.

The session closed by expressing profound gratitude to attendees. Special acknowledgements were given to Michelle for her effective online moderation, and to the technical team, who ensured the smooth orchestration of the event.

Daniel Ospina Celis

Indigenous communities in the Colombian Amazon are demonstrating a keen interest in obtaining internet access, according to a study led by the researcher, Daniel Ospina Celis. They perceive the internet as a vital tool to access essential services and fulfil their human rights needs, particularly within the realms of healthcare, education and political participation. Given the geographical remoteness of their locations, the internet could potentially act as a vital connection, linking them with healthcare professionals and circumventing access issues caused by distance. Aside from its role in healthcare provision, internet access can also augment their educational opportunities and facilitate their active involvement in state matters.

Despite this enthusiasm, the study also sheds light on concerns within these indigenous communities about the potential cultural impact of internet access. Indigenous leaders voice anxieties that exposure to global cultures via the internet could risk their traditional culture, especially amongst the younger generation. They fear that a widespread adoption of foreign cultures could lead to a detachment from their indigenous roots.

Regardless of these anxieties, the leaders do not outright oppose internet access. They instead propose the initiation of strategies aimed at reinforcing and preserving their indigenous identities. By striking a balance between internet access and measures designed to foster cultural preservation, these communities can potentially sidestep cultural erosion.

This study highlights the pivotal role policymakers could assume in this context. Policymakers are encouraged to strike a balance between promoting the benefits of technological advances and preserving the unique cultural identity of indigenous communities. Initiatives aiming to foster internet connectivity within these communities should ideally be implemented alongside strategies and policies engineered to bolster and safeguard their characteristic identities.

In conclusion, the study suggests that while the promotion of technological advancements, such as internet access, amongst indigenous communities harbours potential benefits, it must be undertaken with due regard for the preservation of cultural heritage. Policymakers, therefore, bear a significant responsibility to ensure these communities can reap the rewards of technological progress while simultaneously respecting and enhancing their cultural heritage. The researcher believes that this balanced approach could contribute to empowering indigenous communities with modern tools whilst simultaneously cherishing and preserving their unique identities.

Michael Souza:
and wait for more people to come. Thank you. Can we turn to you?

Daniel Ospina Celis:
Good morning. It’s a pleasure to participate in this session via video and a shame that I cannot join you in person in Japan. My name is Daniel Ospina Celis. I’m a researcher at the Center for the Study of Law, Justice and Society, De Justicia. De Justicia is a think and do tank based in Bogota, Colombia that works to strengthen the rule of law and promote human rights in the global South with a particular emphasis in Latin America. I would like to share with you some of the key findings of a research that I did last year. This research was recently published by the Digitales and can be found on their website under the title Internet Access of Indigenous Peoples in the Colombian Amazon. I am particularly interested in how indigenous communities interact with the internet, what devices they use, what platforms they use, and if having internet access impacts on their indigenous identity. Two of the main findings. First, indigenous peoples are very interested in having internet access. They see internet as a way to fulfill some of their human rights and as a way to access services that currently they don’t have access to. For instance, healthcare. Accessing healthcare is very difficult in the Colombian Amazon because the nearest hospital might be at four, five, or six hours away. Granting internet access would allow them to connect with a doctor online. They also think that internet access would promote the education and the way they participate in state issues. On the other hand, however, some of the indigenous leaders see in internet access a threat. They do not claim that the internet should not be promoted in the Amazon. However, they claim, on the other hand, that although internet access should be promoted, it should also be promoted some strategies to construct, to strengthen the indigenous identity because having internet access might threaten their identity as kids would start, would be in contact with something that is not theirs. Although they see the threat, they still consider that with adequate strengthening mechanisms, internet access would promote their rights. These recommendations, on the one hand, that they are interested in having internet access, and on the other, that to have them and not have a negative impact, their identity should be a strength, must be taken into account by policymakers in Colombia. Thank you very much.

Ms Paredes:
Hello from Fundación Internet Bolivia, a nonprofit organization that works to defend and promote human rights on the Internet in Bolivia. Together with Wilmer Machaca and Eliana Quiroz, we developed our research in four locations in the Bolivian Amazon. During the completion of this work, we approached a reality that surprised us. Despite Bolivia being known as a country of mountains and highlands, most of the country’s territory is part of the Amazon ecosystem. So to say, it is jungle. In this context, we are happy to share with you three main findings from our research that was done during the post-COVID-19 pandemic, which represented a radical change in digitalization processes in the country. Our three findings are, first, social organizations in the Amazon are very active, are very active, facing the state. For example, to negotiate access to services from the state, indigenous organizations covered the expenses of people from their communities to travel to government offices. Second finding, the implementation of the virtual education policy was not possible because the internet coverage was deficient and the equipment did not work or were not enough. The last finding is that the same agency that is exercised by the civil society for access to services has allowed them to develop positive visions around internet, solving their demands and needs. The research revealed that despite the gaps in internet access, which are a reflection of other inequalities, the different communities have identified on the internet a space to guarantee their rights, build economic relationships, self-expression, and identity construction. Initiatives such as the dissemination of black language, establishment of decision-making and organization groups, as well as defense against disaster and dangers, are some examples of the construction of other communication processes and a more horizontal dialogue alternative towards the world from the local vision. Finally, we invite you to learn more about our research that highlights the diversity of the region and the post-COVID reflection. Thank you very much for your attention.

Dagmar Tilguth Fundamedios:
Hello, how are you doing? I had loved to be there in person, but I could not do it so far, so I hope this video can help you. My name is Dagmar Tilguth Fundamedios, an Ecuadorian civil society organization that promotes freedom of expression and access to information. Fundamedios researched internet access in Pastaza, the largest Amazon province of Ecuador and home of seven ethnic groups. We studied internet access of three indigenous nationalities, the Kichwas, the Shuar, and the Wauranis, which are the most numerous in that province. We selected two populations with different access roads, which of course determine the extension of electricity and the internet services. Despite the province of Pastaza being the largest in Ecuador, it is one of the regions with the least infrastructure for internet. 41% of those who survive only have access to satellite internet, as they live in towns that do not have permanent electricity. 40% access the internet via cable and 10% have mobile connections. Private initiatives with high prices are for some the only way to connect. Although people access services sporadically, they pay prices that are equivalent to 17% of the national base salary. On the other hand, there is a strong community sense by sharing internet services among friends and family. In many places, teachers or medical staff provide the services to the community, paying from their personal budget. During the pandemic, when schools shut down, the disparity in access to internet was more evident, and students in the Amazon jungle were left behind with no options to online education. Despite most of the people that participated in our study agreed that education is the best use of internet, reality shows that where there is access to connectivity, young people tend to use social media and, of course, for gaming. Therefore, many consulted adults are worried about the loss of identity among young indigenous people. There is concern about access to foreign content that leads to acculturation, since there is no content reflecting the values of their nationality. Teachers and community leaders agree that the influence of social media has an impact on their culture, which could lead to social problems. Many adults in Ecuador refer to internet as the vice. But of course, in such a large extension as the province of Pastaza, internet and social media are critical to connect families and to support communities, businesses, as well as organizing indigenous leaders and their demands. Finally, all agree that the need of state policies are really required for the progress of the Amazon region and access to internet services as human rights. That is all I can tell you about our research in Ecuador and I wish you a wonderful conference. Thank you so much.

Paloma Lara Castro:
Hi everyone, this is Paloma Lara Castro from Derechos Digitales. In this opportunity, I’m going to talk about a research that’s called Latin America in a Glimpse, Amazonia, which focuses on internet access gaps in the Amazon region. This research was conducted in collaboration with the organizations Fundamedios from Ecuador, Dejusticia from Colombia, IDEC from Brazil, and Fundación Internet Bolivia. These organizations investigated not only the gaps in access, but also the risks and the desires as perceived by the indigenous communities living in the territories. For its part, Derechos Digitales made a comparative report highlighting the common points of the four investigations, the need to generate public policies of connectivity from a holistic and situated perspective that involves the communities in every stage of the policy, and the value of exploring alternative models of internet access, such as, for example, community networks. Although there are particularities in each community, the research shows that it’s possible to identify common problems, experiences, and desires relating to internet access in the communities. For example, the research shows that the social inequality that is experienced in the region is also reflected in the access of internet, which has a huge impact on the local population. This can be seen clearly in the access and exercise of human rights, such as access to health, education, public services, and freedom of expression, among others. The majority of the population is disconnected, and when they do manage to connect, they find that the connection is limited, it’s expensive, and it’s of low quality, with the added problem of the lack of digital literacy. The result is that these groups that have been historically excluded from the access of rights not only encounter the same barriers in the access of internet, but these inequalities are amplified with the interaction or lack of interaction of technology, which generates new forms of exclusion. Beyond certain differences, the communities express a common interest and need to access the internet as a way to access human rights, and also as a way to foster community development. From the conclusions of the reports, it can be seen clearly that technology can be an important ally for the communities. But in order for this to be possible, it is key to advance in public policies from an intercultural perspective that have the objective to achieve technological autonomy as part of the internationally recognized right to self-determination of indigenous communities. In that sense, from a significant access perspective, it’s important not only to provide connectivity, but also to generate an environment that allows for indigenous communities to make full use of ICTs in order to promote their worldviews and expand their capabilities.

Michael Souza:
Well, thank you so much. Again, thank you so much for you for coming to the session. We know that it’s very early. We know that for most of us, we’re really far from home. We’re tired and jet-lagged, and the whole process of registering could be a little bit time-consuming, so we’re very grateful for you to be here. What you just saw was some pre-recorded intervention from some of the people who were in charge of the local research on this project called Latin America in a Glimpse of Amazonia. But we’re lucky enough to have Camila here from IVEC, who’s going to tell us a little bit about the research in Brazil. So, Camila Leide is a lawyer and specialist in digital rights in the Brazilian Institute of Consumer Protection, IVEC. She’s a professor of digital rights and consumer law at IDP, and a PhD candidate in competition law in the University of Sao Paulo, Bachelor of Law at the University of Sao Paulo and University of Lyon. Is that right? Go ahead, Camila. Thank you.

Camila Leide:
Thank you so much, Vladimir, and also, Carlos. Thank you for you that are here so early in the morning, and for those who are also online with us. It’s a pleasure to be here, and it’s a pleasure to talk about this research and about Brazil. And thank you also to Direitos Digitales for this partnership that involves this project and also other projects. We admire you a lot. Let me put my time in here so I don’t get lost. So, I will talk a little about Internet access in Brazil, focusing on Amazonia. And beyond talking about this research, I will also put some inputs related to Internet access researches that we have in IDEC. We have a series of seven researches that we have published related to school access, 5G, related to mobile, Internet, broadband. And I will talk about some of the findings while I explain more about this research. But I will focus on this main research. But first of all, let us understand the Brazilian context of that. In Brazil, we have advanced a lot on Internet access, but we still lack meaningful connectivity. Brazil is full of contradictions and ambiguities related to inequalities in general, and Internet access is not different from that. We have inequalities related to economic inequalities, regional inequalities in different regions of Brazil. We are focusing on the north region today. Also, in localities in terms of urban and rural areas, and also depending on companies’ interests on these areas. Also, we have advanced on some policies related to telecommunications, but we still have some challenges related to the coordination of these public policies, which brings challenges related to how can we promote universalization of Internet access. It’s also important to highlight that in the last few years, regulation has been reduced by the previous government. So, the goal to achieve universalization of Internet access was really harmed by these policies. But with this government, meaningful connectivity is a priority, so we are hopeful to advance on that, and also hopeful to use a fund of universalization of Internet access, prioritizing the regions that suffer the most, especially the north region. So, I will focus on that. Let me talk a little about the research that Diretos Digitales conducted with us. So, this research focused on a community called Nossa Senhora do Livramento, which is almost 30 kilometers far away from the capital of Amazonas. So, it’s far away from Bolt. It’s not that distant, but it’s by Bolt. So, it’s a place that lacks infrastructure in general. Let me contextualize, before talking about the research, let me contextualize about the north region in Brazil. The north region, the northern region, is the biggest one in Brazil. It’s the poorest one, too, and it occupies 40% of the Brazilian territory. It has seven states, but faces lots of challenges and has lots of conflicts related to environmental and humanitarian reasons. The Amazonian community is very diverse and has a specific subjectivity, and outside people have this imagination that does not understand the complexity and the difference that is present in there, but we didn’t focus on the entire Amazonian community in Brazil, which couldn’t be done. It’s very diverse, but we focused on this specific community. This is a place that has approximately 300 people, and we conducted this research with 40 questions related to socioeconomic background, internet access, internet use, and its limits and possibilities. We interviewed 12 people of this community with a difference of gender, race, and ethnicity, and especially indigenous peoples, people from Baré, Miranha, Desana, Moura, and Mucuxi, difference of age, and also classes. And what did we find? First of all, some structural… First of all, some structural… …concerns some structural issues is that this specific community is present in a place that face challenges related to climate change, so related to rains and also dry soil. Because of that reason, infrastructure is hard to advance. So because also of these natural problems, it’s hard to have infrastructure in there. Beyond that, they face challenges related to electricity. So beyond not accessing internet, they also… Some people don’t also have electricity in general. But what did we find? We find, as we expected, that this scenario is excluded. We have inequalities on internet access, high prices, low quality, and normally they use internet access in the mobile phone. So it’s important to pause and also talk about the difference in Brazil of the mobile phone in relation to broadband. Broadband in Brazil is based on speed, and mobile internet is based on data franchise. What happens? If you have a low cost of data franchise, you cannot buy sufficient data franchise for the entire month. So what happens is that people don’t have internet for the whole month. They don’t have internet to explore the potentialities of internet. So I will highlight two things related to that. First of all, people are using internet mostly related to social media. So people are dependent on big techs. People are dependent on also exploration of, for example, privacy issues. Second thing, EDA conducted a research that the poorer classes in Brazil have internet only for 21 days a month. So for one week at least, people don’t have internet. They don’t have internet to reach out for their family, to reach out for help, and they also don’t have internet, for example, to access health system if they need. So this is a big challenge. Also related to using the cell phone instead of using a big screen apparatus. I forgot the word, sorry. Beyond that, internet is a new technology for lots of these people. So they still have to advance on internet literacy. It’s important to focus on this because beyond infrastructure, they still have to learn how to develop the potentialities of internet beyond social media. They lack knowledge, unfortunately. And one thing that is very specific, and I would also love to talk about you about that, is that, and I’m talking not only about the research, but I’m also talking about the Brazilian context right now. People want to advance on internet access, but they are willing to advance in any way. One concern that we have right now in the Amazonian region is the dependency on Starlink, which is related to Elon Musk. And related to Starlink, we are concerned about digital sovereignty, about environmental issues related to satellites also, and how the government didn’t make a full partnership. They made a partnership with… Thank you. …with Starlink, but it’s not official. So it’s a little sketchy how Starlink is advancing and how people can be dependent just on Starlink. …have a monopoly company there. To end about the findings of the research, three of these 12 people didn’t use internet at all, and seven of them just used mobile internet. So that’s why I highlighted these issues. And five of them could afford broadband internet, but since they don’t have sufficient infrastructure, they still face some challenges on internet quality. Also, another research of us, also with Derechos De Retales, about the north region, found out that the prices can vary 200 times per megabyte in the north region, which is absurd. People cannot access internet with these prices. And they don’t have the same amount of quality as capitals. How can we advance on that? This is a challenging scenario, right? And it’s not only related to Brazil. It’s related to the whole region. But in relation to Brazil, we have to remember that internet is an essential service in Brazil, and we have to advance on the universalization. We have to enhance public policy related to the use of funds, to the universalization of internet access, and both the states and the cities have to collaborate also with that. Also, we have some alternatives. Beyond depending on the big companies, we could also think about community networks, and I would love to hear talking more about that. So that is the scenario. We hope we can advance on that. But having this data can help us talk with the government and find solutions on all of that. So thank you for the opportunity.

Michael Souza:
Thank you, Camila, for joining us today. Thank you for all the people who have come to this session. We know it’s early. Also, thank you to all the people that are following this session on Zoom and on YouTube. It’s late in Latin America, where most of them are, so we really appreciate the effort. And, right, as you said, there’s a big challenge that has to do with how to advance with universal access and meaningful access, and that’s why I think it’s very interesting to have Carlos here today who can tell us a little bit about those alternatives to these big companies, the Elon Musk satellites and all that. So I’m going to pass the word to Carlos. Carlos Baca, he has a Ph.D. and a master’s degree from the Autonomous University of Puebla, and a bachelor’s degree in communication sciences from UDLAP. Since 2019, he’s part and is a manager of the training program in ICT network management in indigenous and rural communities in Latin America, and also part of the LockNet initiative by Rizomatica and APC, coordinating the capacity building area and the national schools of community networks in Asia, Africa, and Latin America. Is that right? Go ahead.

Carlos Baca:
Hi, everyone. Thank you for having me. It’s a pleasure to share this session with you. And, of course, I am very thankful because you are here in this early session. So I want to focus not so much in the challenges that have been addressed in all these reports, but more like in the alternatives we need to develop in this area. So I will start with a little presentation. I want to share with you some photos, and you can travel a little bit to the Amazon region. So I will be talking about two different initiatives, very different, and how we can learn some things through these processes of developing community networks in the region. So the first one is the National School of Community Networks that has been developed in Brazil since 2021, and is one of these five national schools. We have other ones in Indonesia, South Africa, Kenya, and Nigeria. And just to say very quick that each of these schools have three different stages. One of the design, the collectivity design of the school with a lot of people involved in that. Then the implementation of the school. And then the last phase that was a mentorship and a little micro-grant for the organization who took part of the school. So the Brazilian one was developed by Projeto Salud de Gria, I can’t pronounce it well in Portuguese, and it has a place in six communities in the north of Brazil in three different states, in Acre, in Amazonas, and in Pará. And as Camila said, very, very different communities, very, very different ways of living, and very, very, very far between each other. So it is a challenge how to develop this there. And I have one bad news. Because, you know, all of the process of the school was to think how the technologies can be addressed in different contexts, and as PSA is an organization that works a lot with community communication, they decide to focus a lot on community research. radio. But in the connectivity side, they work, they finally start working with Poblos de Floresta, that it is a very big, big, big, big initiative with a lot of companies, a lot of organizations, some of the local and state government there involved, and they want to connect 5,000 communities in the Amazon in the next two years or so. So how they are doing it? With Starlink. So yes, if you travel to there, I was there in July, and you can see all the challenge that implies to develop a backbone to the Amazon and to reach the communities and to see that the prices are very high, and also the quality of the internet is very, very bad. And also in some communities, they don’t have electricity, so it is also a problem. One of the communities of the school that calls Aldeas Olimoes, they only have electricity for three hours in a day because they use a diesel producer of energy, so they don’t have electricity all day, so they can’t use also internet and everything in Aldeas. So they did that. And on the other hand, we have another project that is called Hermes, and it is a project that has been taking place since 2015, when we started to think and develop a technology that can allow the use of a high frequency to transmit some of the data that is important in the communities. You know, maybe the internet is not the only way to connect communities and to face all the challenge that implies you know, you say that the education, the access to health services, the access to government services, etc., we can do that also through other technologies. So we developed Hermes, that is a technology that allows some type of data through these type of networks. So we have now different services. We can send an email, we can send a public message between the community station, like a closed network, but also we can connect to the internet, one of the radio bays, and so we can send a message to internet through one, only one radio base connected. And we have these two apps, one of it is the administration, and you can also get a browser, you can search things in one of these, and the other one is a message app. And we have developed this into two main territories in the Amazon, on the one hand in Rondonia in Brazil, and the other one in with the Alchar nation in Ecuador. So far, we have these two systems working, but we are work also, for example, in Chihuahua in Mexico, who is in the very mountain area, very difficult to connect to, and this type of technology is used for this area. So, very quick, what are the lessons we learned in the Amazon? And actually, it’s much a lot with what we have learned in the community networks movement in general. So one of the lessons, and one of the most important lessons, is that local complementary solutions are more sustainable because they have a direct link with the community’s way of life, so they address the real needs of the communities. Then, enabling environments and synergies between different stakeholders is necessary. We can’t have this type of projects alone, we can have a very good synergies with other type of stakeholders, including the government, including different organizations, and in some cases also big companies or big operators. The choice of technologies to be used must be always respond to the context and the territory. I share with you two different technologies, only in these two cases, but we have many, many other options. So, it is important to make a good process of selection of technologies because they are key to address really the needs and to face the challenge in different territories. And as we saw in the Amazon School of Community Networks, the link to the content creation and community networks, it’s key, it’s very key, because the important thing of the network is not the network itself, it’s the things that travel through this network. So, it’s important to make a good effort in the content creation. And finally, capacity building and digital literacy is key, but not only to focus on the tools or to focus on how to use the internet, but more like how we can have a different critical thinking of the technologies and then how they can be used for the purpose of the communities and to address the real needs, dreams, etc. Just to finish, I want to invite you all to see more about these projects. On the one hand, the Community Network Learning Repository, they have all the information about the schools, and you can also see a lot of materials there, and you can share also a lot of materials there. We want to make it as a collaborative space, and if you want to know more about Hermes, you can go through the Resomatica website. Thank you very much.

Michael Souza:
Thank you, Carlos. That was really, really interesting. So, this is the part where we can talk, and we don’t have much time, but we have some time to have a little conversation, and I want to invite everyone who, if you have a question or a comment that you want to make, please do. Also, people in the Zoom channel and in the YouTube channel, you can participate too. We will try to address your comments and questions, and I want to start. I want to give maybe like half a step back in the conversation and talk a little bit about, because this session is called The Internet We Want, with an emphasis on the word we. So, I think that the key concept here has to do with autonomy, and this is something that you, in both of your interventions, but I want you to ask a little bit about the concept and the importance of autonomy regarding internet connection, especially when we’re talking about these specific communities, indigenous communities, that has a right to decide, but how does autonomy look like when we’re talking? Carlos gave some clues in his presentation, but I would really like you to give a little bit of words regarding the importance of autonomy

Carlos Baca:
So, yes, I think that autonomy is the key to when we talk about the future of the internet we want, because these communities have the opportunity to think of the technologies and what they can manage to draw the type of access they want to have. But in this process, capacity building is key. If we think that the technologies need to be included in different types of life and different territories, we need to depart from very good critical thinking of the technologies which the communities can decide. The autonomy is not like a place where we can go and travel through, and we have a very happy place in which we will stay, but more like a process, a process in which we all have the possibility to decide how we can address our problems and how we can follow our dreams. So, if we understand that the technologies are very helpful for the communities, but only with departing from this, from the understanding of the risk, of the possibilities, of all the contexts that are involved in the technologies, and then to take decisions that help to solve the needs and follow the dreams in each of the communities. And I think that in your intervention, you said something that was very important that has to do with how to develop a critical approach regarding the internet and connectivity and the role that connectivity has in our lives. And I think that that’s a challenge that it doesn’t stop with, it’s not just these communities, it’s all of us, like, all the time. Like, how can we think about different schemes for connection, like, different ways to connect and the reasons why we connect, and that’s not an easy task at all. I’m kind of curious regarding your experience in the schools, especially, like, what, how is the, when people think about connectivity, what are they thinking, like, what does that look like? What are their, what they want to achieve with connectivity? Well, the experience of the development of the schools is very, very inspiring and interesting because we can see all the different perspectives of the connectivity of what we can understand about meaningful access, for example, no? So, each of the five schools are very different, completely different, no? For example, we have here in Brazil one school that have been working a lot in the content production and community communication, but we have another school very well-structurated and more, like, in technical issues, you know, in South Africa. Another one who decided to implement some artificial intelligence technologies in some communities with a fisherman and with a woman who take care of the shrimp farms there, no? So, yes, we need to understand that the internet is not one, no? I remember in Berlin, in the IGF in Berlin, we had a very big discussion about this slogan that said that one internet for all, or something like that, no? And I think, as the Zapatistas in Mexico said, they say that queremos un mundo donde quepan muchos mundos. It’s like, we want a world in which we can have a lot of worlds, no? So, we want an internet in which we can have a lot of internet, no? Not only one way to connect. I think there’s a question or a comment from the public, like, maybe this time.

Publika:
Go ahead. Hi, my name is Wilson Guilherme. I’m from the youth program in Brazil. I live in the Amazon region of the country state of Rondonia, and that’s why this panel is very important to me. I believe in the potential of the discussions to be held in the IGF. My question is, what are the possibilities of building an alliance at SILAC to build a technology network to prevent U.S. imperialists like Elon Musk from dominating our territory with two perspectives of solving the Amazonian people? Sorry, my English. Thank you. Thank you. My name is Paulo. I’m from Article 19 Brazil. I’m sorry, I couldn’t listen to Camila’s presentation, so I’m sorry. I’m going to refer to Carlos’ one. I’m really glad that you mentioned the Hermes project, and my question goes to everyone, actually, including for discussion. We all know that working with community networks and access connectivity and so on is quite hard to do in terms of hardware, software, knowledge, and so on, but then people normally connect the idea of connectivity and access to the internet, to access the internet, and the Hermes, for example, is another project. It’s another idea. It’s like connecting more the digital sphere than the internet itself, so my question would be, what is the importance of having not necessarily the internet, but the digital technology in the hands of community, given two different axes, two different things, one culturally and the other one is material production, because digital technologies can help out, not necessarily with access to internet, but to help out the material production, what the communities are producing and so on, and also the production of culture, like music, oral history, poetry, and so on. This not necessarily has to do with internet connection, but it has a lot to do with digital technology flowing in and out from the communities with the sovereignty and autonomy and so on, so thanks a lot. Hi, my name is Niels, in this case from DW Academy. My question is to Camilla. Can you share about the dreams from the community that you visited, because you told that people are very attached to social media, but what are the alternatives, and what are really the needs that they dream of, of what they can do on their territory with more internet? Let’s take the last one. Okay, thank you. My name is Camilla from Bolivia. I only have a question. I would like to know how did you address, as you work with indigenous communities, how do you address about their identity and things, because there is this question about having the internet, have the development and everything, you know, but as I work with indigenous communities too, I know they have also this thing about they don’t have maybe some information about their culture on internet, and so they want to be on internet, but also they want to support that. What is your experience with this kind of schools or things? How do you work with that, with their identity, and how to combine this, right, like the access, but also don’t lose their identity? Thank you.

Michael Souza:
So, who wants to go first? I think Camilla has some stuff, so it’s your turn.

Camila Leide:
Okay, I can start. First, a news question about the dreams of the community. One of the reactions was that no one asked us how internet should look like. No one prepared us to use that, so their willingness is also to have more connectivity, but also more understanding on how can they use the internet. This is very interesting, but we have a challenge of autonomy and how do they choose, because it’s easy to have one big company that brings all the solution as Starlink, but people don’t have knowledge enough to think about alternatives, such as networks, communities, so it’s important to develop also this digital literacy, so they can have the informated autonomy to choose what kind of internet they want. I think this is important, but related to their culture and their context, this community in the Pacific, in Brazil, it is really close to the capital of Amazonas, so it’s a community that has their own culture, but they are very interconnected with the big centers, so when they are using internet, they use more to expand, to lower the distance and to expand to other spaces, and their culture is more developed on that, but yes, they face some challenges on how to keep their culture, and about Will’s question, it’s a big challenge, right, because it’s so seductive to have a company that says you will have internet in a low term, but I cannot guarantee that you’re not going to be attached to me, like really dependent to me, I cannot say about the prices in the future, I cannot talk about the environmental issues, so we have to think some alternatives, and we were talking a little about the right to decide autonomy, and we have to have more spaces to hear people in the end, when they’re making public policies, they don’t hear civil society that much, and they don’t hear that much the communities they’re affected. I can talk about civil society in general, we face lots of challenges on participating, for example, on the community of the universalization fund in Brazil, we have to ask them a specific authorization to participate on that, the telecommunications authority, they have public consultations, but they have in a lower term, we have some challenges that the telecommunications agency is very close to the private sector, but we have some participation spaces such as the consultant committee, we have the consumer committee also, and in part of EDEC, we try to participate actively in these spaces to bring some other perspectives, but beyond civil society talking about homogeneous problems, we have to hear people in the end also. Thank you.

Carlos Baca:
Yes, I think we can have all these questions with a sake or a beer, because it’s very difficult to try to give an absolute answer, but one thing that I think is important is to the part that, as we have the right to be connected, we also have the right to be disconnected, and this is very important. If you want to see some discussion about it, we have a blog in the Resumatica site, because we also think that we need to have this right very well understood, that we can have this right to be disconnected. So, this is on the one hand. On the other hand, these technologies help a lot to maintain the identity and to rethink also the identity in the communities. We have seen in a lot of communities that we have this problem between the young and the old people, because they are discussing a lot how is the best way to address these technologies, and how we need to include them in their lives. So, it is important to start to generate that dialogue before to include the technologies. I think this is one of the keys. And also, between the indigenous itself, they have a lot of knowledge of what are doing the other communities. So, they look for that experience a lot in their territories and outside of territories, and they can start thinking how to use these tools to reinforce their identity. Of course, we can’t think that it is a white or black process. They understand that they want to be connected, but they understand also that they want to be connected with some limits that, for example, in a community network we can have. We can limit the time of the network operating, for example. So, some communities decide that after 8 p.m. they don’t have internet connection, for example. Or if you are in YouTube more than two hours, you can’t connect more. So, yes, I think the key is to understand that there is not only one solution, that a lot of these solutions have a lot of risk. Of course, to be connected with some guy who can decide to turn off the satellites and say that you can’t have internet because I have a bad day, it is a problem. It is also a solution that needs to be understood by the community. So, if the communities understand this risk and how can manage it, this is the key, I think. Well, thank you so much, both of you. Thank you so much for

Michael Souza:
all the questions. We’re running out of time. I just want to say that I think in the end what’s important is to think about why do we need the internet? What do we need connectivity? What do we want to achieve with that? And as Carlos said, there’s no single answer to that question. There are many answers and the shape that connectivity takes has to do with how we answer that specific question. But as I say, we’re running out of time. Sorry. I just want to give you, both of you, one minute for final remarks. But before that, I want to say thanks to everyone for coming here, Michelle for doing the online moderation, and as Carlos said, there’s a lot of questions that we keep on discussing with sake or beer or just water, maybe, at this time of the day. So,

Camila Leide:
let’s keep talking. One minute, each of you. Thank you so much for the invitation. I would also like to thank Lua Cruz, which leads the telecommunication part in IDEC. He has an amazing work. I learn a lot from him and he also helped with this research and helped me a lot with this presentation. I hope we can continue this dialogue. We have a consensus that no size fits all, so we have to think how can we advance on that, what are the specificities that we need to develop, and I hope we can continue this conversation. So, thank you for the invitation, thank you for the exchange, and thank you for you for being here, too. Thank you for having me. We

Carlos Baca:
need to know that there is another option to connect and to have access to the telecommunication services, so we need to depart from that and from that dialogue between different stakeholders. So,

Michael Souza:
thank you very much and have a great IGF. Have a great IGF. Thank you so much for coming. On your way out, please take one of these. If you unfold it, it has a really cool poster that you can, I don’t know, do something with it. The other way around. Okay, so it’s there. Please take one. Thank you so much for coming and I hope to keep on talking regarding all this stuff. Thank you for all the technical team, too. Thank you so much. Thank you.